Author Topic: Trouble with Being Cioran  (Read 4416 times)

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The Creature

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #30 on: February 16, 2019, 12:22:11 pm »
That is a powerful statement!

I will quote it since the page just turned to 3.



Quoted by Holden:
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"The only reason why I flatter myself, is that I understood very early, before the age of twenty, that one should not procreate. My disgust towards marriage, family and all social conventions has its source in this. Crime is to transmit one's frailties to someone else, to force someone to experience the same things we are experiencing, to force someone to the Way of the Cross that may be worse than our own. I could never agree to give life to someone who inherits misfortunes and evil. All parents are irresponsible people, or murderers. Procreation should belong only to brutes. Pity makes you not want to be a "progenitor". This is the cruelest word I know." (Emil Cioran, "Cahiers 1957-1972" ["Notebooks 1957-1972"], 1997)

"If I was a believer, I would be a Cathar." (Emil Cioran, "Cahiers 1957-1972" ["Notebooks 1957-1972"], 1997)

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Thanks Holden of Northern India.  Those notebooks are difficult to come by.  There is a version that may be in Portuguese (like Spanish?  almost the same?) Cuadernos (1957-1972) = Notebooks (1957-1972) (Biblioteca E.M. Cioran).  There are a bunch of copies selling at a reasonable price.

It looks like there is an English translation of "Notebooks", but only 3 copies are available, one in Brazil, one in Switzerland, and and one in Australia.  The one on Senor Raul's continent looks to be the most affordable.

As long as you are putting in the years at that salt mine office, Holden, you really deserve to reward yourself with such a priceless hardcopy.  There are no digitized version to be found, unless you or anyone else knows of any.  Holden, you deserve to have one of those rare copies!

ISBN-13: 978-1-55970-632-2 / 9781559706322

Here in one volume, are the essential writings in the 34 notebook's Cioran left behind at his death, not a journal but a sort of exercise manual, in which he tries out his formulations, perfects the expression of his obsessions and whims. The notebooks are rich in anecdotes, accounts of meetings, portraits of friends and enemies, descriptions of excursions and sleepless nights. Here are the lists, day after day, of failures, sufferings, anxieties, terrors, rages, and humiliations, curiously at odds with the daytime Cioran, so mocking and tonic, so comical and various. These brief entries constitute a backstage glimpse of a tormented mind, wise in its very torments, solitary in its wisdom.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2019, 11:04:54 pm by Kaspar the Jaded »
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

Gorticide @ Nothing that is so, is so DOT edu

~ Tabak und Kaffee Süchtigen ~

raul

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #31 on: February 16, 2019, 07:34:24 pm »
Holden,

Thank you for sharing these wise words by Cioran. But we, humans, are not wise Only a few like you, Hentrich, Silenus,Ibra and others I do not remember in this blog are wise enough to read Cioran. 

This morning I went to the hospital and in the pediatrics section there are many mothers with their children. I saw a pregnant woman with three children playing with her smartphone waiting for the doctor. Another woman was taking his child with glasses. Others were just waiting too. It is in women´s software to offer their intimate parts to the males´ hungry phhallusses. Years ago I used to go to a **** store in downtown Asunción. I saw the owner giving the price of huge dildos to the couples sometimes. Sex is business. I am sure going to **** stores will be forbidden by law.

Unemployment is increasing and I start seeing female taxi drivers, some of them pregnant, and sometimes bus drivers. I wonder if their children will be able to endure life. As we have mandatory military service for men, for women is the mandatory pregnancy service. The wolves in power need sheep for sacrifice.

I read somewhere that for the Aztecs the women who died giving birth to children for the first time they were equal to the warriors who fell in the field of battle. All of them went to the House of the Sun. When the sun set in the morning the brave warriors celebrated these women until noon came.

As you wrote before:
“After so many wars and so much mayhem the hospitals are still filled every day with the cries of new born babes.Why do the babies cry-is it because they realise the kind of mess they have got themselves into by being born?”

“In the Victorian era the infant mortality rate was exceptionally higher. Before van Gogh was born there had been another Vincent who died when he was just one.van Gogh was taken by his mum to the grave of the other Vincent to pay respects.”

I guess the first Vincent turned out to be the luckier one.”

Take care on the train.

The Creature

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Notebooks: To Be Destroyed
« Reply #32 on: February 17, 2019, 10:57:31 am »
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

Gorticide @ Nothing that is so, is so DOT edu

~ Tabak und Kaffee Süchtigen ~

The Creature

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We cannot forgive those we have praised to the skies
« Reply #33 on: February 18, 2019, 02:22:08 am »
"We cannot forgive those we have praised to the skies, we are impatient to break with them, to snap the most delicate chain of all: the chain of admiration ..., not out of insolence, but out of an aspiration to find our bearings, to be free, to be ... ourselves.  Which we manage only by an act of injustice."  ~ from The Trouble With Being Born
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

Gorticide @ Nothing that is so, is so DOT edu

~ Tabak und Kaffee Süchtigen ~

Holden

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #34 on: February 20, 2019, 02:54:16 am »
Senor Raul,

From Karl  White:

What a curse the libido is. An absolute curse. I went on a few dates with a very attractive lady before Xmas, who was willing to 'go all the way', but made it abundantly clear that her sole aim in life was to be impregnated. For once, I made a rational decision and cut loose.
(She's 38 and in a massive hurry to hatch).

Keep well.
La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.

The Creature

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #35 on: February 20, 2019, 10:40:27 am »
From:  The Trouble With Being Born (1973)

Everything is wonderfully clear if we admit that birth is a disastrous or at least an inopportune event; but if we think otherwise, we must resign ourselves to the unintelligible, or else cheat like everyone else.

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Commentary from just another aging student of mathematics (2019)

This is one of those aphorisms which may prove quite useful as a meditation to begin the day with, as soon as one gains consciousness.  Even when tragic accidental deaths occur, such as the case of a speeding automobile, operated by a driver in the throes of overdosing on narcotics, taking the life of a gas station attendant from India (and two patrons) in New Jersey, one can trace the disaster back to the original distaster of having been born in the first place.  Maybe that is an extreme example, but for an aphorism to become a mantra, it surely must be capable of being applied to even such extreme cases.

On that note, another aphorism from the same section of The Troble With Being Born:

Say what we will, death is the best thing nature has found to please everyone.  With each of us, everything vanishes, everything stops forever.  What an advantage, what an abuse!   Without the least effort on our part, we own the universe, we drag it into our own disappearance.  No doubt about it, dying is immoral. ...
« Last Edit: February 20, 2019, 12:50:13 pm by antihero H »
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

Gorticide @ Nothing that is so, is so DOT edu

~ Tabak und Kaffee Süchtigen ~

raul

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #36 on: February 20, 2019, 05:12:23 pm »
Holden,

Thank you for your response. I think you and Hentrich and others in this blog say it all. I have nothing much to add. Karl White, yes, from Say No to Life, wrote deep thoughts and what he did was something few would be willing to cut loose as he said. Like you, Hentrich and a few others, he went against his software, so to speak.
Cioran wrote that “The spermatozoon is the bandit in a pure state.”

I read that in Santiago del Estero, Argentina, a father locked his six-year old son in a freezer because he “behaved badly”. The police there rescued the little boy from the freezer after they received denunciations from the neighborhood. The father was arrested there. In the hospital the little boy was checked by the doctors and they found out that he had injuries of recent beatings. The father was arrested and testified before the prosecutor of the case. The father said that he locked the boy up because he stole money to buy cookies. This event was reported by Extra.com.py.

Yesterday I also saw on Paraguayan TV that a grandfather (72) was sentenced to six years in prison for raping his four grandchildren, all girls. The mother is in Argentina, like many Paraguayan women, working there. So they have to leave their children under the care of their parents.

Here in my neighborhood I see boys sleeping on the streets. They are window cleaners. Not many car drivers are kind to them.   

I once told an acquaintance that should I ever go to jail for a crime, my parents would have to go with me or at least be called to testify and see how the product of their heat is being punished. You see, in judicial proceedings when someone is sentenced to jail, the court employee starts reading the sentence and says “Juan Pérez” son of “Justo Perez and Juana Pérez” etc,etc. I heard that many do not like to hear their names of their parents being read in court. 

But both my parents passed so they won´t suffer for their son. Death saved them.

I have learned never to underestimate people because even the most peaceful man or woman can react violently. I also learned that I can do ugly things. It is part of our human nature. We all love to kill. This is the reason homo sapiens sapiens is super predator, as you know already. We establish laws to punish killing and yet we dream about it.

Take care.

Holden

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #37 on: February 21, 2019, 01:52:44 am »
To Herr Kaspar  and  Senor Raul,
“At the 1211 council against the Bogomils, the ones that sustained that the ‘woman breeds in
her womb with Satan’s help, and that Satan dwells there from the beginning until the birth of the child ’ were anathematized”. Although I don’t dare to imply that the Devil would show so much interest towards us as to accompany us months in a row; but I also could not doubt the fact that we have been procreated under his supervision and that he truly offered assistance to our beloved creators."-Cioran

Keep well.
La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.

raul

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #38 on: February 21, 2019, 06:49:32 pm »
Holden,

Thank you once again for sharing Cioran´s aphorisms.

If we reincarnate, not a pleasant prospect, do you think we will come back to this mental asylum aka Earth as women? Who knows?

Other quotes, I read, by Cioran:

No longer ask me for my program: isn´t breathing one?
You must do some work, gain your livelihood, muster your strength.
My strength? I´ve wasted my strength, used it all up erasing whatever traces of God I could find within myself and now I´ll be unemployed forever.

Every action flatters the hyena within us.

I believe in the salvation of humanity, in the future of cyanide.

Have you ever heard of Hermann Burger?

Take care.

The Creature

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Karl White?
« Reply #39 on: February 21, 2019, 10:35:49 pm »
Are you saying that this Karl White is the same Karl as from Say No To Life  ?
« Last Edit: February 21, 2019, 10:37:40 pm by antihero H »
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

Gorticide @ Nothing that is so, is so DOT edu

~ Tabak und Kaffee Süchtigen ~

raul

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #40 on: February 22, 2019, 07:56:54 am »
Hentrich,

Thank you for the link. I think the Karl White, quoted by Holden is the Karl White of Say No to Life.
You wrote that you don’t´t “give a fuuck about what other people think of me, especially about the opinions of those who would judge me for "living off the taxpayers." In my view whatever amount of money you get from the government, it goes back to the system because you spend it in things you need everyday.

You are not transferring that money into secret bank accounts in tax havens in the Caribbean or somewhere else. You are not using that money to gamble in the casino in Monte Carlo. The thing is that you are not damaging the U.S. economy. I read that the famous Colombian drug lord Pablo Escobar Gaviria once started a fire with US$ 2 million because his daughter was cold. It is the taxpayers that helped him start that fire.

Take care and drive safely.

Holden

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #41 on: February 22, 2019, 10:18:07 am »
Senor Raul,
Not all suffering is bearable.  -Gloria

Keep well.
La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.

Holden

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #42 on: February 23, 2019, 04:00:49 am »
Herr Kaspar,
There  is an  anti-natalist group  on  facebook  and  I lurk around them with a  pseudonym.That is  where   Mr.White writes too.I think he is the  one from  "Saynotolife" as he had told  me   before his blog disappeared that  most of   his anti-natalist  colleagues have migrated to  the facebook group.


 
La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.

raul

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #43 on: February 23, 2019, 07:42:52 am »
Holden,

Yes,Gloria is right when she says: “Not all suffering is bearable.” Honestly I can only now focus on my physical suffering, that is to say, I have prostate problems and most days after I **** I have pain in the orifice and the ophtalmologist told me that I will be half blind. I see very little with my right eye. I inherited this health problem. Nothing to be done.

Maybe if I had the fortune of David Rockefeller or Jacob Rothschild, I could get another kind of treatment. I looked at the picture of this Rothschild, and he is of the same age of my father and yet he looks probably twenty years younger. Strange really. This is the only suffering I can write about.

Take care on the train.

Holden

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Re: Trouble with Being Cioran
« Reply #44 on: February 23, 2019, 11:23:06 am »
Senor Raul,
If we reincarnate, not a pleasant prospect, do you think we will come back to this mental asylum aka Earth as women? Who knows?-Senor Raul

"Maybe rebirth is simply HAVING KIDS". Jack Kerouac

Keep well.
La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.