Author Topic: Weirdo-Rejectionist  (Read 12186 times)

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Weirdo-Rejectionist
« on: October 22, 2015, 08:40:08 pm »
We need a joke disguised as a religion ... Kind of where Vonnegut was going with the Bokonists

Since the term "weirdo" is kind of insulting, I thought we could refer to our imaginary cult as "Weirdo-Rejectionism" - the Rejectionist part based on David Benetar's theory that coming into existence is harmful, and hence one may be on the moral high-ground by not bringing life into the world even if this has not so much to do with "choosing not to reproduce" as it has to do with "not being chosen to reproduce" ...

This term is subject to change constantly.   

It also elevates the term "weird" to a different level than how it is thrown around in the streets, and puts it more in the realm of Lovecraft horror fiction and a Cioranesque attitude toward the universe. 
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2019, 06:36:38 pm »
NOTE:  This post is not a letter to anyone in particular.  I could just as easily be writing to myself.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Instead of a joke disguised as a religion, how about a science disguised as a joke?

The Art and Science of Antinatalism ?

I have this sense that I am destined to be viewed as a joke by this Universe which treats "my struggles" with cosmic indifference.  Just maybe Kurt Vonnegut was on to something with making up a nonesensical religion.   I wish to do something similar but opposite.   How can something be similar but opposite?

Well, since I am destined to become the personification of the "accidental comedian," a term I am coining to designate a serious thinker who is not taken seriously by his contemporaries, rather than responding in the usual ape-like manner of pounding chest, slamming stick on ground, and throwing poop (or, nowadays, my god, humans running down humans intentionally with their motor vehicles ... how many such timebombs among our populations?), I feel my heart changing.  I mean, I'm thinking I will "play the Idiot" to their St Petersburg, the Ignatius Reilly to their Confederacy of Dunces.

God knows there are enough comedians in this annoying world, but to be a living joke and keep a straight face, well, then one might experience a small inkling of what a basic mathematics teacher must experience as he or she is mocked daily by swarms of TV-fodder.   In the future, I can see a rise in "teacher eruptions."

Anyone can snap at any moment, and I think most the gorts the world over are underestimating the threshold capacity of our very selves as a species.   What is our tolerance for absurdity as a species?  It will be different for each individual, different in siblings, different maybe depending on individual temperament.  I'm for sticking around, but I have noticed my own limits starting to glare  ... In fact, the reason I am collecting "government relief" (Ignatius's term) has everything to do with my apparent deficiency in being able to "tolerate" the psychological abuse modern day "employees" are expected to endure.

I am gort-intolerant, hence Gorticide can't be subjected to steady and repeated abuse by spoiled, rude, philisitines.  It might push him over the edge.   It's best I don't see the masses up too close and personal lest they shock my senses with their rude behavior.    Jailbirds and inmates on psychiatric wards have more respect for a sentient life form than some of the mall-rats in Bizarroland. 

What would the science of antinatalism entail?   Ceasing to reproduce.  Flipping the script.  Making a mockery of the sexually attractive hordes enthusiastically breeding human misery for the sake of appearances.   The joke is on the gorts!

Isn't that a relief?  Be a knower rather than a sufferer.  Know that the gorts are fuucked, and be glad!  Rejoice in the firm knowledge that this carnival that sits on top of garbage heaps, prisons, and malls is certainly not sustainable.  Not only this, but the gorts themselves are having a difficult time believing the lies they have to tell themselves each day to keep up the farce of society.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2020, 02:29:42 pm by Sticks and Stones »
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

Gorticide @ Nothing that is so, is so DOT edu

~ Tabak und Kaffee Süchtigen ~

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2020, 11:02:39 pm »
The human predicament : a candid guide to life's biggest questions  by David Benatar

From the description:

Are our lives meaningful, or meaningless? Is our inevitable death a bad thing? Would immortality be an improvement? Would it be better, all things considered, to hasten our deaths by suicide? Many people ask these big questions -- and some people are plagued by them. Surprisingly, analytic philosophers have said relatively little about these important questions about the meaning of life. When they have tackled the big questions, they have tended, like popular writers, to offer comforting, optimistic answers. The Human Predicament invites readers to take a clear-eyed and unfettered view of the human condition.

David Benatar here offers a substantial, but not unmitigated, pessimism about the central questions of human existence. He argues that while our lives can have some meaning, we are ultimately the insignificant beings that we fear we might be. He maintains that the quality of life, although less bad for some than for others, leaves much to be desired in even the best cases. Worse, death is generally not a solution; in fact, it exacerbates rather than mitigates our cosmic meaninglessness. While it can release us from suffering, it imposes another cost - annihilation. This state of affairs has nuanced implications for how we should think about many things, including immortality and suicide, and how we should think about the possibility of deeper meaning in our lives. Ultimately, this thoughtful, provocative, and deeply candid treatment of life's big questions will interest anyone who has contemplated why we are here, and what the answer means for how we should live.

Holden

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2020, 03:10:53 pm »
Bad things happened today. I was quite jittery.It was mathematics that came to my rescue. I became the eye that sees the world,it does not want the world to be forced into a certain pattern.It merely watched.

You say,in your dreams,you befriended the monster. The monster here might be nature itself.When you befriend the monster,in someway,you recognise that you are a part of it.We are a part of nature.The theologians might say otherwise but the truth is truth.

Earlier I was looking at the maths solutions all the time. Now, I try to do it on my own,as much as I could, and then look for the hint as regards the specific point which I find to be beyond my grasp.

My natural instinct,when confronted with some kind to stress, is to root out  its cause. Like any other animal. Yet, its not always clear as to what is causing what. Instead of reacting with animal instinct,I want to hold back, if only for a moment, and just be the eye that sees the world.





La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2020, 11:36:59 pm »
Quote from: Holden
You say, in your dreams, you befriended the monster. The monster here might be nature itself. When you befriend the monster, in someway, you recognise that you are a part of it. We are a part of nature. The theologians might say otherwise but the truth is truth.

And what a Monster our great earth mother is!

I want to bring attention to a passage that leaped from Benatar's The Human Predicament:

Quote
The overwhelming majority of turtle hatchlings are eaten or otherwise die after surfacing from their sandy nests before they can make the few-minute scamper into the ocean. More die in the mouths of ocean predators. "The little turtles come out into a world anxious to eat  them."

Coming into a world anxious to eat them.  They have eyeballs and faces, and are driven by impulses which are most likely charged with similar aches and pains we are all familiar with (want, need, necessity).   And these turtles don't even have music to console them. :-\

Quote
It would indeed be wonderful if there were a beneficent God who had created us for good reason and who cared for us as a loving parent would for his or her children. However, the way the world is provides us with plenty of evidence that this is not the case.

So much for the idea put forth by the Native Americans about Our Earth Mother.  This has been a far more painful realization for me than when I lost my faith in a "Creator God" during my teenage years.   I had always still clung to this concept of the Great Earth Mother, especially from reading the translated prayers of native "holy men" such as Black Elk.   And yet, I feel my heart may have turned dark, or maybe I am just preparing my mind, strengthening my resolve to accept that our mother earth's ways appear monstrous.  Would She love some more than others?   Would She be any more gentle with one who whimpered and begged for mercy?   Would She treat all Her children with the same indifference as She does the little turtles?   Do we just not understand Nature's Ways?   

We have within us the inner kernel of Nature, the Original Mother of All Monsters.  We are mostly made of our  inhuman elements and components.  Maybe mankind is a myth.

From page 39 in the chapter, "Meaninglessness":
Quote
Upton Sinclair famously remarked that it "is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it."    It is similarly difficult to get somebody to understand something when the meaning of his life depends on his not understanding it.


I will close my little night-time reflection with the paragraphs leading up to "The little turtles come out into a world anxious to eat  them."

Quote
Imagine you were to visit a country in which the evidence of repression is pervasive: There is no freedom of the press or expression; vast numbers of people live in squalor and suffer severe malnutrition; those attempting to flee the country are imprisoned;  torture and executions are rampant; and fear is widespread. Yet your minder tells you that the country, the “Democratic People’s Republic of Korea,” is led by a “Great Leader” who is an omnibenevolent, infallible, and incorruptible being who rules for the benefit of the people. Other officials endorse this view with great enthusiasm. There are impressive rallies in which masses of people profess their love for the Great Leader and their gratitude for his magnificent beneficence. When you muster the courage to express skepticism, citing various disturbing facts, you are treated to elaborate rationalizations that things are not as they seem. You are told either that your facts are mistaken or that they are reconcilable with everything that is believed about the Great Leader. Perhaps your minder even gives a name to such intellectual exercises—“Kimdicy.”

It would be wonderful if North Korea were led by an omnibenevolent, infallible, and incorruptible ruler, but if it had such a leader, North Korea would look very different from the way it does look. The fact that many people in North Korea would disagree with us can be explained by either their vested interests in the regime, by their having been indoctrinated, or by their fear of speaking out. The presence of disagreement between them and us is not really evidence that deciding the matter is complicated.

Not all of earth is as bad as North Korea, but North Korea is part of “God’s earth”; so are Afghanistan, Burma, China, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Syria, and Zimbabwe, to name but a few appalling places for many to live.  Even in the best parts of the world, terrible things happen.  Assaults, rapes, and murders occur, injustices are perpetrated, and children are abused. 

Fortunately, the incidence of such evil in places like Western Europe is lower than in worse places on earth, but my point is that they all occur within the jurisdiction of a purportedly omnipotent, omniscient, and omnibenevolent God. Nor should we forget the horrific diseases from which people suffer aroun d the globe, or the fact that every day, billions of animals are killed and eaten by other animals, including humans.

The numbers are so staggering that we cannot even compute them. However, to get some sense, consider that one study found that common dolphins and striped dolphins along the Atlantic coast of the Iberian Peninsula consume 27,500 tons of sardines, gadids, hake, and scads annually. That is over 75 tons of fish per day—by only two kinds of predators in one corner of the world’s oceans. Globally, sperm whales are (conservatively) estimated to consume 100 million tons of cephalopods.
 
 The annual loss of wildebeest to predators is estimated to be 42% of this prey species’ total biomass. The overwhelming majority of turtle hatchlings are eaten or otherwise die after surfacing from their sandy nests before they can make the few-minute scamper into the ocean. More die in the mouths of ocean predators. "The little turtles come out into a world anxious to eat them."

Imagine how ridiculous we appear even making some kind of "plans" or taking on some kind of "project" in such a world.   If there are Invisible Intelligences observing us, we must keep them laughing hysterically every time we make plans or try to accomplish some kind of "work for posterity."

If Raul and the Gnostics are correct, then becoming allies with the Monster of Creation might come down to not taking ourselves so seriously, and just see what happens.  Like you said, Holden, "I became the eye that sees the world, it does not want the world to be forced into a certain pattern. It merely watched."







« Last Edit: October 30, 2020, 12:15:22 am by Sticks and Stones »
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

Gorticide @ Nothing that is so, is so DOT edu

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2020, 10:33:09 pm »
This is a link to a direct download of a 65 page paper, UTOPIC PESSIMISM: THE MESSIANIC UNDERPINNINGS OF THE ANTINATALIST POLEMIC
by Joshua Robinson Miller


A thesis submitted to the faculty of The University of North Carolina at Charlotte in partial fulfillment of the requirements for the degree of Master of Arts in Religious Studies
Charlotte 2015


I sense this may be an argument against Antinatalism, in that the author seems to be arguing that Antinatalism contains "hope" and is therefore optimistic. 

ABSTRACT:

"Pessimism in the west was made into a system by Arthur Schopenhauer. It has never been a popular philosophy but provides rich insights into the nature of human desire and the possibility of happiness in a materialistic cosmos. Antinatalism, the idea that birth has a negative rather than positive value, has been a component of pessimism since the beginning. In the last ten years antinatalism has been a developed into a system of its own. This new antinatalism magnifies the antinatalist observations of earlier forms of pessimism into a moral rallying cry. Today’s antinatalists go so far as to recommend a voluntary extinction of the species through an avoidance of reproduction. This paper explains the pessimistic background of modern day antinatalism while at the same time showing the ways in which modern antinatalism makes use of utopian and messianic hope in its moral response pessimistic philosophy. This paper further claims that pessimistic philosophy is only consistent with itself to the extent that it remains descriptive. The antinatalist solution to the problems of existence engages in a messianic optimism that is not allowed to the secular pessimistic mind."

 ???

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2020, 09:17:10 am »
I have been reading through UTOPIC PESSIMISM: THE MESSIANIC UNDERPINNINGS OF THE ANTINATALIST POLEMIC late at night.  It is worth reading.  It has many deep insights into our predicament.

I'm still pecking away at "the maths" --- but it truly is some kind of science fiction.  Having trigonometric circular functions running through my mind does not exactly put me on the same page as those who vote in national elections.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2020, 10:25:45 pm by Sticks and Stones »
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

Gorticide @ Nothing that is so, is so DOT edu

~ Tabak und Kaffee Süchtigen ~

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2020, 09:57:27 am »
I wonder how much suffering fate has in store for these kids.

La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2020, 10:07:12 am »
I think I can understand what you are working on-both mathematical and coding/programming projects.
Only at the moment I am trying to build very,very strong foundations-which I could not do due to  back luck when I was younger.

I think in a few years,2 or 3 or 4 maybe 5, I would ready. Provide of course, as you say,Lord willing and the creek don't rise.
La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.

Holden

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #9 on: November 10, 2020, 10:12:19 am »
As the kids sing in the video:

There's a time that I remember when I never felt so lost
When I felt all of the hatred was too powerful to stop
Now my heart feel like an ember and it's lighting up the dark
I'll carry these torches for ya that you know I'll never drop, yeah
 :'(
La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.

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« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2020, 12:36:58 pm »
Holden,

Thank you for the read. It is a strange story. I am afraid more of human demons. You can see them at broad daylight. Most of them also drain us of our energy. You are experiencing it in your office with your colleagues.
I heard that in a city in Spain the members of a council are debating if males with bigger balls are more violent than those who have smaller balls.
It is a strange to see ourselves programmed like machines. Who built/programmed this complex biological organism called homo sapiens sapiens?

Our brain is a complex network of 86 billion neurons. Why make such an effort to build the human race? We are troublesome creatures. Why create creatures that finally will rot away inside a cheap coffin and become breakfast to little maggots for a few years?

I remember the 1999 movie The Matrix. In that film, the human race is a source of fuel for very advanced machines that thrive on our electrical energy, while we unknowingly live in a dream world born out of a sophisticated hologram—the matrix of the movie’s title. Indeed it is intriguing.

In the tube I listened to a researcher say that according to Tibetan Buddhists a tulpa is a creature that is created and driven by the power of human imagination. Can we say that humans were created the same way? I have no clue.

I quote a writer, Charles Hoy Fort, who said that, we, the human race, are “animals here for the slaughter and incapable of seeing the greater and more terrible meanings that surround us.”

Well, in short, we are sscrewed.

Sleep well.


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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #11 on: November 10, 2020, 10:28:34 pm »
Quote from: Holden
I think I can understand what you are working on-both mathematical and coding/programming projects.

Only at the moment I am trying to build very,very strong foundations-which I could not do due to  back luck when I was younger.

I understand why you wish to proceed in as intellectually honest a manner as possible, for your own peace of mind.

The masses may be distracted by the circus of political elections and Kafkaesque Nightmare Castles, but, for me, it takes hard core, no nonsense, to the roots, trudging through mathematics curriculums creating or enhancing solutions to the exercises, always thrilled to stumble upon something NOVEL during this seemingly endless traversal.   It is like a Sisyphian Boulder I roll up the hill each day, trudging along ... pointless existence of turtle mesmerized by abstact symbols.

I admit with the utmost intellectual honesty that the mathematics is pure distraction from meditating too long upon what the point might be of breathing and satisfying needs, wants ... These "projects" I engage in, my message in a bottle to an imaginary future, it is all a fiction used by my nervous system to entice the Beast to trudge along, to humbly and dilegently peck away.

I admit to not fully appreciating the severity of my "chains" (to existence, that is).  I have only been close to death a few times, but every time I nearly choke on my food, I instantaneously experience the Will to Live in my own Animal Body.

Still, Holden is on point in suggesting spending a good portion of our mental energies meditating on death, for it reveals a very mysterious element about the nature of our biological existence.   Death and biology are related intimately.  Our awareness of death may be our species' universal curse, but I can't imagine that any of the "higher" animals are not aware of death.  They see it every day.

Yes, perhaps cockroaches are also aware of death.

But, plants, vegetation, no - I do not think they know this thing "death."

Death is in time and space.  And yet I am of bones and veins, blood and guts and excrement.

So many lies we must keep puffed up as a false reality so that we do not reflect too long on our true natures, the one that has to urinate and deficate, the one that gets tired, exhausted, overwhelmed - the animal creature Thing.  As I said before, I distract myself from these brute facts by trying to focus on getting through the last of a series of texts I've been working through.  It is my own little world, like the shell of a turtle. 

The entire project has taken on a significance like one might find in a story by Poe or Ligotti or even Lovecraft, where I, the protagonist, have ventured so deeply into the roots and structure of pure mathematics, discovering a secret delight in going over ever-so-meticulously those texts from high school that I had once blamed for my nervous breakdown, that I have been able to cement a kind of parallel-universe reality, where I am able to take certain ideas seriously which most people I come in contact with find useless if not annoying and boring - this is the hum-drum thread holding my entire life together.  I even leave little comments that certain exercises are "mechanical" or "dull" or "boring," noting specifically where Schopenhauer might use the term "drudgery," where he suggests, in the 1800's, creating a machine to perform the task as it is pure tedium for the sentient human consciousness.  I suppose some of his contemporaries were tinkering with such machinery, as the ancients have been doing for eons I imagine.

I understand that the first set of exercises in each section may be meant to give the student some confidence in basic structure as it relates to methods.  I am a patient man who must be bonkers for "sticking to his plan" even as it has proven to be some kind of lifelong task preventing me from "venturing into the workaday world."  It would be evidence of some kind of obsession.  Obsessive and compulsive serving of my Muse, toiling where She commands.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2020, 08:01:36 am by Sticks and Stones »
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

Gorticide @ Nothing that is so, is so DOT edu

~ Tabak und Kaffee Süchtigen ~

Holden

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2020, 09:36:42 am »
he entire project has taken on a significance like one might find in a story by Poe or Ligotti or even Lovecraft, where I, the protagonist, have ventured so deeply into the roots and structure of pure mathematics, discovering a secret delight in going over ever-so-meticulously those texts from high school that I had once blamed for my nervous breakdown, that I have been able to cement a kind of parallel-universe reality, where I am able to take certain ideas seriously which most people I come in contact with find useless if not annoying and boring - this is the hum-drum thread holding my entire life together.  I even leave little comments that certain exercises are "mechanical" or "dull" or "boring," noting specifically where Schopenhauer might use the term "drudgery," where he suggests, in the 1800's, creating a machine to perform the task as it is pure tedium for the sentient human consciousness.  I suppose some of his contemporaries were tinkering with such machinery, as the ancients have been doing for eons I imagine.-Herr Hauser

Most people fail to go down the rabbit hole because they are too occupied with superficial aspects of life. I have come to realise that if I spend enough time with mathematics then it could be as intriguing as HPL's or Poe's world.

Beyond a certain point there is no return. This point has to be reached.-Kafka

I wish to reach that point in mathematics.


We are all stuck here whether we like it or not. Doing math seems to be ,to me, the least harmful activity possible.It does not disturb the beast. There will be chaos from time to time,it cannot be helped. But if could spend a great many hours engrossed in math,then, at least I won't be perturbed for that much time.



La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2020, 10:57:59 am »
I remember becoming curious to see if I might "reformat the hard drive" of the organic computer we have cased in our skulls.  Surely, after a few decades, and after exposure to higher mathematics at the university, I might be a more prepared student (for getting to the roots of the structures of pure mathematics) than I would have been as a teenager.  The authors of the series were devoted and obsessed.  They were radical set-theorists.   :)

Anyway, in the so-called Real World of Society, which puffs itself up into significance, I am miserably judged for "smoking tobacco all day" - just killing myself with tobacco, in this parallel dimension, the one in the mind where the abstract symbols of mathematics exist, where the Real Numbers, Integers, Rational Numbers, Complex Numbers exist, where matrices exist.  I am nourished by the practice, and even though I wake up in the morning angst-ridden, always struggling with inner misery, always talking the Angry Frustrated Will/Beast/Creature through it.

This goes for mathematics drills as well.  The Creature often protests, as Hesse hints at in Der Steppenwolf, when his Wolf-part mocks everything the Man-part holds sacred and holy.  I have compromised somewhat.  The Beast/Creature does get to enjoy stillness and calm when truly engaged or interested.

Since I am creating Solution Key modules along with the notes, when my attempt is way off, or if I sincerely do not have any idea on how to proceed, I have no choice but to consult the old worn original solution keys.  This instills humility if I keep in mind my goal of intellectual honesty as regards the development of mathematical maturity.  Like you Holden, the one I am always trying to convince of this maturity or level-of-understanding is myself and myself alone.   We are our only audience, in the end.

That teenager I was would be very impressed with this old dog's grasp on the subject matter.   :)

The depressing solitary life of an "economic dead-beat" serves as a parallel dimension to the diligent monk at work.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2020, 11:01:17 am by Sticks and Stones »
Things They Will Never Tell YouArthur Schopenhauer has been the most radical and defiant of all troublemakers.

Gorticide @ Nothing that is so, is so DOT edu

~ Tabak und Kaffee Süchtigen ~

Holden

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Re: Weirdo-Rejectionist
« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2020, 12:59:47 pm »
I think you are doing with mathematics what you have already done with philosophy-reaching the very bottom.
La Tristesse Durera Toujours                                  (The Sadness Lasts Forever ...)
-van Gogh.